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Hypothetical discussion on fixed bids

Discussion in 'Netfleet.com.au' started by AnthonyP, Aug 16, 2013.

  1. AnthonyP

    AnthonyP Membership: VIP

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    Nice thing about that thread is that it will be purely hypothetical so lets have a go at it...

    Can you give me some hypothetical issues with fixed bids for everyone?

    In the hypothetical world I'd probably even make it blind too. Maybe you would get a daily list and you can only see your bids. Auction ends we try to catch them for you and after the catch is completed we inform you of your success or failure.

    Purely hypothetically speaking guys...
     
  2. AnthonyP

    AnthonyP Membership: VIP

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    Would you care to explain to me why?
     
  3. neddy

    neddy Membership: VIP

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    auDA Member:
    Yes
    How about you go first Anthony?

    • Please tell us why you want to change a tried and tested proxy bidding system?

    • What are the advantages to your core customer base?

    • What other drop platforms worldwide use this type of system on a daily basis?
     
  4. BenWalker

    BenWalker Membership: Community

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    I use to be a big advocate for Netfleet. But due to recently dealings, I’ve lost a lot of confidence in the brand.

    I completely understand a business needs to be innovative and find ways to make money. Especially when the market is slowing down due to less good domains dropping. However, you need to be completely transparent with your customers.

    To put it short, I would not trust you guys to conduct blind bidding properly. Because who knows what other under the table/ exclusive end user offers you guys will be making to certain clients.
     
  5. AnthonyP

    AnthonyP Membership: VIP

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    In a nutshell domain investors get transparency.
    Published sale prices are higher (where an end user bids).
    End users get names they are really keen in a simple to understand format.
    Domain investors can leverage the same bid format to sell their own inventory.
    There is no need to bid at a set time, you can put your bids in and walk away.

    I am unsure about other drop platforms worldwide, but I did take a quick look at this one so I am happy to discuss the hypothetical pros and cons of reverse auctions which have started up in the tLD land.

    http://dnx.com/
    http://domainnamewire.com/2013/06/27/new-domain-marketplace-dnx-com-formally-launches/
     
  6. neddy

    neddy Membership: VIP

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    auDA Member:
    Yes
    I don't know why you spent ages on the phone with me a month or so ago? You asked for my advice on some issues (thank you); and I gave you some thoughts and suggestions.

    I also told you to have a look at the business model of expireddomains.co.nz. That works really well imho, and it creates a real contest - with extended bidding in worthwhile increments -
    plus it is totally transparent with bidders nicknames.

    And what have you done since? I'll tell you what you've done in PR terms. By your recent controversial actions, you have created a "rod for your own back". By that, I mean Netfleet's
    business reputation has suffered immensely. After "eels", you promised to forewarn us of any marketing initiatives. You didn't - and it's come back to bite you in the bum big time.

    A lot of your core customer base have now lost varying degrees of trust in how you operate. That is now starting to come out loud and clear.

    • We truly want you to make lots of money and be around to service the needs of domain buyers and sellers.

    • We want you to do so in a transparent fashion.

    • We want a level playing field.

    • We don't want NF to compete against its own customers.

    • We don't want the potential of inside knowledge being used against us - either innocently or purposely.

    • You've got a great platform. Sure - improve it, tweak it - but don't wreck it; or further damage your reputation.
    ------------------------

    As for dnx.com, that is a "dutch auction" - and it is aftermarket names. Not expired domains. I know the guy that runs it.
     
    1 person likes this.
  7. findtim

    findtim Membership: VIP

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    auDA Member:
    Yes
    firstly i don't like the idea AT ALL, i wouldn't buy a house/car/antique this way so why go down this path?

    secondly i think you open yourself up to a "black market" one in which you lose eg: people could manipulate thier bids leaving only $10 bids on the table for $300+ domains. " you take that one i'll take this one" whereas now when you have a bidding war the best price gets paid.

    what i see here is presently you can see the cream you are missing out on in the proxies and you are just getting the milk below.

    i'm more then happy for someone to ring me and ask " hey tim, i'm onto blabla domain today are you" ? "yes" " whats your proxy" ? ahh, i was going to go to $115

    i really don't care because come the end of the day thats what i was going to bid and if i lose i lose.

    BUT, if that persons proxy was going to be $65 then i want to pay $66 not $115

    if i really want the domain i will say " my proxy is HIGH "

    at the moment you have a good fair system, correction........ up till a few weeks ago you had a good fair system.

    please grab your duster and rub this off your chalkboard, its not going to work for well you.

    "so if my proxy was $115 i was prepared to pay that so why not be happy to pay it as a fixed bid" ? because i really don't want to..... i will.... but i don't want to.

    tim
     
  8. snoopy

    snoopy Membership: VIP

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    This would result in generally lower prices than today in my view. Usually this kind of thing is an attempt to get higher prices where their is a big disparity between bidders by trying to make the market non transparent.

    ie netfleet looks at an auction where bidder A bids $100, bidder B bids $200, auction ends at $101. Netfleet thinks they should get $200.

    In the real world though under a fixed bid system people will just bid well under their maximum. Bidder A might make a fixed bid of $50, bidder B $80. They'll respond to the lack of transparency with lowered bids. Whereas before it was about competing with other bidders it would now be about competing with the drop house.

    Instead of Netfleet constantly trying to get people to pay more for names than they are worth they probably should just accept that the auction system has been used for 2000 years and probably isn't something that should be messed with.

    All of the recent nonsense from Netfleet and this latest "hypothetical discussion" reminds me a lot of the pool.com blind bidding shenanigans from a few year ago. More competition is badly needed.
     
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  9. findtim

    findtim Membership: VIP

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    auDA Member:
    Yes
    umm, yeh... like snoopy said :)

    thats what i was trying to say but snoopy nailed it

    tim
     
  10. domainlover

    domainlover Membership: VIP

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    I have to agree with Snoopy i would respond to the lack of transparency with lower bids.
     
  11. AnthonyP

    AnthonyP Membership: VIP

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    As I said purely hypothetical thread and not meant to draw the same amount of venom...

    Thanks for the feedback.
     
  12. findtim

    findtim Membership: VIP

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    auDA Member:
    Yes
    100% of nothing is nothing, so the community start bidding lower, NF spend more time and resources trying to find endusers and get a few wins but overall everyone loses.

    So in the past everyone has come to you, now you will have a system of knocking cold doors to get better prices which is tough going.

    tim
    ---------------
    story: this is TRUE HONEST to god conversation, and i had it last saturday at a kids birthday party for a 6 year old by another father.

    he is serbian now living here, we were at "laser tagging" where the kids go through a dark set of corridors and shot each other.

    i said " man, imagine doing that with real bullets, those guys in afganistan must have balls, going into a house, down an alley and not knowing who to trust or whats around the next corner"

    his reply was QUOTE " i was in serbia during the war and when the UN came in, everyone turned into a terrorist, it was our country and we didn't want them there, the people united and even at times joined with the enemy to stop the UN succeeding "

    just can't help but feel the community will become terrorists united and the UN are the people getting charged to much for domains in that "other" thread.

    tim
     
  13. Ashman

    Ashman Membership: Trader

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    There is no doubt that the Netfleet engineers have created a great domain catching system. They seem to have worked out a way to acquire the majority of the expiring domains before any other drop catching provider.

    I always thought they were able to do this because auDA allowed Netfleet to share registry connections with six other registrars, giving Netfleet a total of 7 registry connections to catch domains.

    On the other hand, Drop is only other drop catching provider. auDA has allowed Drop to share registry connections with two other registrars, giving Drop a total of 3 registry connections to catch domains.

    There have been discussions in the past about the disparity between registry connections of Netfleet and Drop. If I recall both Netfleet and Drop both said that the number of connections makes no difference in the catching process.

    If the number of connections each Drop Catching Provider have make no difference in the execution of acquiring expiring domains my question is this:

    Why don't the auDA restrict each provider to one registry connection each?

    That way it would at least appear to a layperson to be a level playing field.
     
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  14. findtim

    findtim Membership: VIP

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    auDA Member:
    Yes
    if you are talking about my comments its not venom, this conversation has been happening offline WAY before the "other" thread even started, you asked for feedback and i started giving it.

    if NF was my business i'd like to know what people really think rather then assume or guess.

    tim
    "go collingwood"