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Goodies v Baddies

neddy

Top Contributor
I just read an old online blog post relating to the resale of domain names by "domain resellers / domainers". It was written from the point of view of an enduser trying to negotiate a purchase in the dot com space.

Needless to say, it inspired lots of hateful comments (and a few positive ones). One of the positive responses was this one below - and I quote it because it's how I see myself and a number of fellow Aussie domainers / investors.

Obviously our local industry also has "cowboys" that potentially spoil it for the rest of us (you see it every day on the drops).

Just my opinion of course - I'm interested in yours.


The domaining industry is one of the most misunderstood business models, often lumped in with “cybersquatters,” those who squat on trademarked names and established company names.

Most of us in the industry are NOT cybersquatters; we deal in generic and brandable names and avoid obvious TM domains. We buy virtual property and resell – no different from buying real estate and allowing it to accrue value and then selling for a profit. Isn’t that capitalism in action?

It’s too bad the baddies give us a bad name; most of us are just business people who happen to deal in virtual properties.

I’m sorry if “your” desired domain name is already “taken,” but I’m also sorry that I didn’t get in the ground floor of Google. However, I’m not going to cry about it; I’ll just follow my own path in life, and that happens to be a domainer (among other labels).

And being rude to domain owners isn’t going to lower the price of your desired domain.
 

Bacon Farmer

Top Contributor
I think the quote is pretty much on target. It does make me laugh when the ignorant get upset about stuff they obviously know nothing about.

Who are these local cowboys and what are they doing?
 

findtim

Top Contributor
knowledge = $$ and thats why people get p^ssed off, because they just woke up and discovered they didn't register their business name as a domain WHEN it was a generic !!!!! eg melbournedentist

being rude to them doesn't do any good for anyone, you both leave feeling bad and the person may cause you trouble out of spite so i try to avoid that.

a guy rang me tuesday to ask if i wanted to sell a domain but we couldn't agree on a price, he runs a resort on an island up your way ned and by the end of the conversation he invited me to come over next time i'm up there, thats a far more pleasant result.

the reality is people are now getting how valuable a domain is TO THEM, but not willing to pay.

i JUST NOW got off the phone to MIT as i inquired about some .melbourne domains

more on that here

tim
 

Horshack

Top Contributor
I remember reading the same article about 3 years ago. From memory they eventually bought the domain for far less than the asking price anyway. I thought the point of the article was that there's always room to negotiate on price.
 

neddy

Top Contributor
I remember reading the same article about 3 years ago. From memory they eventually bought the domain for far less than the asking price anyway. I thought the point of the article was that there's always room to negotiate on price.

You're right Horshack - original article was from Dec 2010; and it revolved around an enduser's experience in negotiating the purchase
of a domain from a domain reseller.

But the comments were diverse - and kept flowing over time - and the one I quoted was posted just last year. It was in response to a lot
of "haters" who had expressed opinions on the characters of "domainers / resellers".
 

snoopy

Top Contributor
Not much point shooting the messenger. The industry has major public perception issues and probably always will.

It stems from not only trademark stuff but from people holding names solely for the purpose of reselling to others. I don't think there is too many other industries comparable. Imagine if you walked around town and 50% of the realestate was for sale and all those properties had been on the market for the last 10-20 years. Those investors/landbankers/"capitalists" would not be popular.

Enjoy domaining, but don't expect speculators to get pats on the back for their "public service". We're as popular as casino operators, used car dealers, lawyers, parking inspectors and stock brokers. No amount of domainers jumping on threads telling the general public they are "wrong" and we are "misunderstood" and appealing to "capitalism" will ever change that.
 

FirstPageResults

Top Contributor
Not much point shooting the messenger. The industry has major public perception issues and probably always will.

It stems from not only trademark stuff but from people holding names solely for the purpose of reselling to others. I don't think there is too many other industries comparable. Imagine if you walked around town and 50% of the realestate was for sale and all those properties had been on the market for the last 10-20 years. Those investors/landbankers/"capitalists" would not be popular.

Enjoy domaining, but don't expect speculators to get pats on the back for their "public service". We're as popular as casino operators, used car dealers, lawyers, parking inspectors and stock brokers. No amount of domainers jumping on threads telling the general public they are "wrong" and we are "misunderstood" and appealing to "capitalism" will ever change that.

Well people looking to buy their first homes do complain about property values being driven up by investment properties :)

But you're right, the industry is poorly understood. Plenty of threads on whirlpool slagging off domainers - and they're generally a tech savvy bunch.

I know when I'm talking to people about investing in domains, I'm always quick to refer to the notion of "generics", as I don't want to be branded as one of the bad guys. Perhaps the majority of these "bad guys" are new to domaining, and think there is big money in squatting.
 

neddy

Top Contributor
The industry has major public perception issues and probably always will.

True. But it never makes it easier when there are a minority deliberately doing the wrong thing. (And I'm talking Aussie space now).

Imagine if you walked around town and 50% of the realestate was for sale and all those properties had been on the market for the last 10-20 years.

You just described Hobart. ;)

We're as popular as casino operators, used car dealers, lawyers, parking inspectors and stock brokers.

You missed out politicians and union organisers.

------------------------

On a more serious note (though it is still humorous), I copped this complaint just recently.

From: STEVE <------------------>
Subject: STOP PIRATING THE ASX URL

Message Body:
WHAT YOU ARE DOING IS ILLEGAL!
WWW dot ASX dot COM dot AU IS OWNED BY THE AUSTRALIAN STOCK EXCHANGE

--
This mail is sent via contact form on Gold Bullion http://www.goldbullion.com.au

(I have redacted his email address and elongated URL to ASX)

The ASX do indeed own the 3L domain.

My domain that actually re-directs to GoldBullion is another 3 letter domain - so "Not Guilty" as charged! I didn't bother replying. :)
 

snoopy

Top Contributor
Well people looking to buy their first homes do complain about property values being driven up by investment properties :)

Sometimes they do, but it is nothing like he level seen in the domain market.

But you're right, the industry is poorly understood. Plenty of threads on whirlpool slagging off domainers - and they're generally a tech savvy bunch.

I'm not saying the industry is poorly understood, I'm saying domainers should stop trying to claim that. It is what it is. Trying to change public perceptions about domainers would be like trying to change public perceptions about used car dealers or lawyers.

Would you trust a used car dealer? If not why not? These people are poorly understood? People need to be educated about their perception of used car dealers?

I know when I'm talking to people about investing in domains, I'm always quick to refer to the notion of "generics", as I don't want to be branded as one of the bad guys. Perhaps the majority of these "bad guys" are new to domaining, and think there is big money in squatting.

The average guy on the street sees domaining as squatting though. i.e. you registrar a domain because you hope someone else will want to register it, then you do it 100 times. The difference between that an property speculation is scale. You don't see half a street for sale at once and all the houses don't stay on the market for 20 years gathering dust.
 

neddy

Top Contributor
Who are these local cowboys and what are they doing?

Not saying this person is a cowboy, but this is the sort of thing I'm talking about. Dropped today.

 

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StuartB

Regular Member
Neddy,

It is the old story - where a couple of guys doing it for a hobby, can cause a lot of trouble for those doing it for a living.

But we do need to be careful not to continue the siege mentality from a couple of years ago. We are not under attack anymore.

If there is still a problem with people not understanding the "rules" - lets educate. Why not have a forum at the next auIGF?
 

StuartB

Regular Member
Yeah good point.

The problems with Cowboys, is that generally roam on their own.

However - that doesn't mean we still shouldn't look at educating the good guys too.

Never know what we might learn.
 

neddy

Top Contributor
It is the old story - where a couple of guys doing it for a hobby, can cause a lot of trouble for those doing it for a living.

But we do need to be careful not to continue the siege mentality from a couple of years ago. We are not under attack anymore.

If there is still a problem with people not understanding the "rules" - lets educate. Why not have a forum at the next auIGF?

Sadly, it's not just "hobbyists" Stu. If it was, I wouldn't bother posting.

And even though the .au policy has relaxed a lot (thanks to Erhan, yourself, and many others who have spent time on panels and working groups), we are still so over-regulated compared to .com; uk and nz (just to give a few examples). So everyday we still have to watch how we operate. Therefore these actions of a few always make me nervous - because one day, the powers that be may decide to change the rules again.

And if you read some of my posts going back years; and my letters to auDA; I'm all for education. But it hasn't really happened. DN Trade and other forums have become the quasi educators.

I like your idea of a specialist session at the next auIGF. Would love to participate.
 

neddy

Top Contributor
Mr "Givenchy" strikes again today.

If you Google him, you'd think he'd know better. :eek:

 

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neddy

Top Contributor
i can not see anyone that is doing these types of registrations joining auda or showing up to an auIGF.

so a forum would be to whos benefit?

I talked to Stu about this because I felt the same way as you.

What he's getting at is a forum where the powers that be can understand what the issues are; and do some brainstorming as to how best auDA can "educate" the masses as to what is good - and what is not acceptable.

I'm not sure what sort of results it would ultimately achieve, but I reckon it's worth a try.
 

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